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PartyT
Administrator
USA
20712 Posts |
 Posted - 11/30/2008 : 11:44:17 AM
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Two Great posts I found on Slots
By hippo925 & Eliot Jacobson
[QUOTE=hippo925;210047]after doing a little research and talking to some people, i found out some interesting things about how a slot machine might work. i apologize for the long post, but i find it to be an interesting theory.
basically, it is apparently impossible to have a true random number generator, as many of you know. slots work with a "pseudo" random number generator that uses an algorithym that uses a "seed" and adds numbers to that seed to generate different outcomes. apparently, the RNG calculates and rotates through these numbers continuously until the spin button is pressed.
it is possible that the algorythms used allow each "number" to be processed ONLY once and the presentation to the player is only a representation for enjoyment value.
as an example, think of a $1 slot that has 100 possible numbers with only 5 numbers representing "wins."
the number 1 = the jackpot value of $50
the number 2 = line win of $5
the number 3 = line win of $10
the number 4 = bonus spins (3 free spins)
the number 5 = bonus spins (3 free spins)
the numbers 6-100 are blanks, near misses, etc.
when a bonus is hit, a separate calculation is used that that consists of 6 possible numbers for only the bonus (that also can be used only once)
represented by:
spin 1 = blank
spin 2 = blank
spin 3 = blank
spin 4 = $25
spin 5 = $5
spin 6 = $3
in other words, you can get a bonus and hit the first three possbile combinations and win $0, or hit the last three and win $33 or any combination of the six possibilities, but each spin can ONLY be hit once.
after one OR more players have completed the cycle of 100 spins, the payback is 98%.... guaranteed.
in this case, you CANNOT hit a jackpot "back to back" and it is very obvious that every spin is NOT random and likely to occur because if someone else hit the jackpot, you will not....in THIS cycle.
how to make this slot more "random?" increase the cycles. add another 9 sets of these 100 spin cycles and now 10 people can hit the jackpot and 20 bonuses are now possible. you can now hit a jackpot "back to back" and the payback is still 98%.
what if you increase it 100000000 more cycles, than it becomes the closest you can get to random.
so why does a slot sometimes not appear to be random? fewer cycles which lowers the variance for the casino for any period of time. (this can avoid too many jackpots clumped together with more consistent revenue.)
also, i learned that ANYTHING is programmable and possible. interruptions to the cycles, re-directions, etc..... you name it, it is possible.
i thought this was an interesting theory and i know some of you are programmers and have much better insight to share.
in summary: apparently slots CAN be very CLOSE to random, but not the way most people think. also, table games like blackjack can programmed in similar ways...but i don't know if they are. i love slots and this theory might explain some things i've noticed. a slot that relies on these type of mechanics is, for all intesive purposes, pretty random unless it is programmed to do otherwise.
ps... a personal thanks to nashvegas. i just find this topic extremely exciting and garry's posts started my interest in it.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Eliot Jacobson;210054]From what I understand, your theory is that slots are programmed to go through a cycle of outcomes in sequential order. You also say: "interruptions to the cycles, re-directions, etc" can occur. Rephrasing, you state that as the cycle grows in length, the appearance of being random can increase as well.
I have programmed a slot machine for an online company, and I can say most definitely this is not how this slot worked.
The basic mathematics of a slot machine is computed via a spread sheet and a simulation of the slot. The analysis of slots via a spread sheet involve computing each outcome possible, and its result. This is how the house-edge is computed for a slot and it is a lot of work. The simulation program verifies the mathematics by playing millions of spins of the slot as a human might play given enough time.
In practice, each spin truly is "random" (the result is computed by requesting a value from a pseudo-random number generator), and no previous event has any effect on a future event's probability of occuring. I would be very interested to see any verified evidence of a slot operating otherwise.
There are most certainly rigged slots in the world, but they are produced by rogue companies, or are the result of incompetent programming. There are also what is known as "class 2" slots which sound a bit more like what you may be talking about. For the difference between class 2 and class 3, see Wikipedia, which I have quoted in part:
Class II game characteristics:
The player is playing against other players and competing for a common prize.
There is certain to be a winner in each game. The game continues until there is a winner.
In a given set there are a certain number of wins and loses. Once a certain combination has happened it cannot happen again until a new batch is initiated. This is most obvious in scratch card games that come in a pack. Once a card has been pulled those winning combinations cannot occur again until a new pack of cards is installed. One game is dependent on previous games.
The player must be an active participant. They must recognize events as they occur and must recognize when they have won and announce their winning. Bingo is an excellent example here.
All players play from the same set of numbers as they are announced.
Class III game characteristics
The player is playing against the house.
There is a very real possibility that the player may lose the game.
Each game is independent of previous games. Any possible outcome can occur in any game.
Wins are announced automatically.
I hope this helps,
--Eliot[/QUOTE] |
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Two Great posts I found on Slots
